I had a dream this afternoon about college, but I'm not in college now. Somewhere in the beginning of the dream, I was at a crossroads, and there was a fighter plane, a Mirage, that was about to crash. Actually I had already seen on TV that the plane crashed. The thing about the plane crash was that the plane was a VTOL one, meaning it can land and take-off vertically and not use the runway, but in the dream, it kept bouncing on the ground for a few times and then finally crashed. The pilots ejected before this. I was on the ground and was afraid it would fall on top of me, but it fell to one side of the road.
I don't remember the part after this clearly, but somewhere around this time, a girl from my college came up and we had started talking. In real life, we hadn't talked much. This girl is a looker (not just in the dream, she actually is), but she was a very dull kind of girl, she was never interested in anything and I hadn't paid much attention to her. Then we reached the college, and she walked down a corridor to her room (this isn't a hostel but in the dream it was her room). The ground floor (in the dream) was for girls alone, and there were two metal grilles on both sides so I couldn't follow her. There was some kind of celebration going on on the ground floor, in front of the rooms where there was a garden, and boys weren't allowed. I went to my room on the first floor, which was for boys, and tried calling home to tell my folks that I had reached the college safely, but I couldn't see the screen of my mobile because of the glare of the ceiling lights. I squinted and just about managed to call back home. Then I noticed that at the center of the corridor, there was a staircase that went down, and I could see the party the girls were attending even though boys were not allowed to it.
In the next scene, she was taking me to her home, at another crossroads, and her home was very close to the crossroads. This whole place is a large city. I said something like do you live so close to the crossroads. She opened the gate to her house, and it was a big mansion kind of place, and she took me to the back (not through the house but by the side), and her room was at the back, but it was at the top of a tower at the back of the house. I glanced to the back of the house and saw that there was a small plot of land on which no house had been constructed, and it was covered with sand, and there were houses all around. I again faced her house, and there were two ladders going up the tower; these were more like hanging ladders though they were made of metal, and they were not connected to the wall of the tower but were hanging from some kind of balcony at the top. She pressed the button for the elevator but none arrived, and finally we started climbing the ladders.
At the top - and the whole thing was made of wood - she showed me her room. It wasn't a large one, but there was another room near it, a small one in which she asked me to sit. All this time, I had thought that she was taking me to her house so that we could have sex, but now she went to her room. I don't remember exactly, but after this, I went to her room, and we talked about something, and she said something and I asked her, are you giving me a hint? Like I've said earlier, she had always been a dull one. She said something like it's not that she didn't want to have sex with me, but she didn't seem all that excited (not that my heart was pounding, but at least I was looking forward to it). Then she said that she had been invited by one of her friends (a girl) to a party tomorrow at about one o'clock in the afternoon, and she said something like cocktail mocktail, and she said that her friend had asked her to mix as much cafe (not coffee) as she wanted. She told me we'd go there and then have sex, so I told her I had taken leave for tomorrow, but since this was night, we should do it now. At this point, I saw that there was a door at the back of her room, and there was a wooden path going out, and other paths joining it, like it was a connection of all such rooms at the tops of houses. One of her friends (whom I know, who is also a looker), was passing by along with two or three others whom I don't know, and this girl I was with had gone outside and was talking with her.
All of a sudden two puppies came up the tower and one of them clamped its teeth onto my right thumb. The other was just sitting there watching. This one was really try to chew my thumb, but there was no bleeding or anything. I tried to free my thumb by using my other hand but it grazed its paw on my hand, and it was really rough. I couldn't free my hand, and the dream ended here and I woke up. I was angry that such a beautiful dream had to end this way, so I went back to sleep, and the dream continued, but this part was a very short one, in which the puppies were gone, and the girl and I were undressing, but there was a comode and the girl was sitting on top of it, at the very back, and I got my thing out, hard, but then the girl pissed on my thing. I said, see, this is what I don't like, but I didn't mean her pissing on my thing, I meant how she was not interested at all.
Help me out with this one.
Dream - fighter plane crashes; girl takes me up a tower, puppy chews thumb
Moderators: eye_of_tiger, shalimar123
Yes and no. I was mostly just curious, I will explain further on. This is the theory, whether or not it ‘sits’ right with you is up to you. I am by no means an expert on psychology or Jung, but rather a curious amateur. I will do my best to explain all this.
I see this dream as being linked to a point of transition in your life (symbolised by the crossroads). According to Jung our lives are made up of several different phases; childhood, adolescence, middle-age, and old-age. Given your age, I would say you are at the cusp moving from the adolescence / young adult stage of your life to the middle age stage.
Let’s look at these two stages: the adolescent / young adult stage is all about defining yourself within society. There is a lot of ego-development, you identify yourself largely by what you do, whether it is sport, your job, your musical genre etc. You basically build your life. Find a nice girl and settled down, maybe start a family. That is generally what society dictates we do – whether we do it or not is not always so.
In the middle-age stage it is theorised that people start to question what they built in the earlier stages, and question if this daily grind is all there is to life. Further, this can result in a mid-life crisis, which is more or less a freak-out and grasping for something more.
Now your dream begins with the aircraft crash. My theory on this is the aircraft is a symbol of the ego – the vehicle that elevates us, plus if you think specifically about Air Force pilots they are renowned for being of ‘the right stuff’ which values high self-confidence hence why they are renowned for arrogance. Perhaps not true these days but the stigma remains – in other words in my experience they are painted as ‘egotistical’. Hence the association I place on this symbol with the ego.
The fall of the ego can be associated with this particular phase as you come to realise that you don’t know everything – that nature often associated with youth; as well as the realisation that you are not indestructible. It can also be associated with the stripping away of many of the levels of personality that were developed in youth. You may be giving up some of the sports you playing in your youth, a lot of these things that helped establish and hold up our ego fall away. Now this can be a pretty frightening thing, when you strip all that away what is left? You have lost your identity and the life that you had, and had spent years building. You might feel empty. But it is a chance to come closer and explore your true self.
It is a bit like the sacrifice, you give up your life, and in that you find your self (not yourself) as it is the comprehension of your true self, who you really are deep inside. I think it is a Buddhist idea, I can’t remember exactly where I heard of that concept, but I understand it.
And this leads into the second part of this dream theory, as well as why I asked if you were familiar with the individuation process. I identify the woman in the dream as being a symbol of your anima – that is the feminine aspects of your psyche, that in men tends to be repressed. The fact that you know this woman suggested to me that you may have been consciously aware of this phenomenon or theory. That you aren’t familiar with it suggests that perhaps you are aware of your feminine side, and / or perhaps she represents something specific – which is the path I am leaning towards. The reason for this is your opinion of her and the role that she plays within the dream.
In your associations with her you state she is a looker, but very dull hence you don’t pay her much attention. I get the feeling this relates to your anima / feminine aspects, you may be aware they are their but do not explore them much as they are seen as dull or perhaps undesirable in substance, hence you do not know the substance of this inner being – you are aware of this woman but you have not really gotten to know her personality.
I think this is hinted in your interactions, you seem to be driven by sexual desire, while that is only a small part of what she is interested in. She is after a more balanced interaction – and seems more about communication (talking).
The scene that the interaction opens is the college – a place of learning and ‘higher education’. This establishes the theme of the dream. Splitting the roles, masculine / boys being conscious, the feminine / girls being the unconscious, this is shown in the layout of the college – the lower ground floor for girls would be the unconscious state, which you are barred from, or at least is not ‘meant for boys’, and the boys part would be the conscious part. However there is a staircase down to this level, you are able to access it, if you know where to look. This I see as the invitation to delve into the unconscious realm.
This is repeated in the next cut scene, the mansion is you, your life, and everything in it. Inside the mansion is the conscious state, outside (where the anima lives) is the unconscious. There is something under construction here, or about to be. It COULD be the new developments of the mid-life phase. Or a new beginning anyhow.
The tower I associate with the dreamscape – a bubble of consciousness within the unconscious realm. Now, why doesn’t the lift work? Because – there isn’t any fast easy way in here to open up this communication. It takes hard work, up the ladder. This I associate with the work of coming to understand and interpret dreams. Sometimes it takes a lot of work to get the meaning, but you know when you get it right because the insights will likely literally blow you away.
There are some interesting associations in the house to some of Jung’s theories, but I might look at that later. For the most part it seems to be about communication, talking, but you aren’t really focussing on that, you just want some action.
This points to the dogs, puppies (developing masculinity) bites your right (logical – masculine) hand. I think this is related to the sexual desire as well, the strong sexuality points to a masculine stance, for men it is a strong driver towards relationships. For women it is still important, but a much smaller part of the relationship than for men. I think this point is interfering with this development / communication.
Which I feel is a sub-morale / lower level interpretation of the dream, that being learning of the difference between men and women, and that for women the sexual act is still something they want (in fact a wise man pointed out to me once, women want it more than men, but they don’t need it like we do – it is a smaller driver for them).
To me it could be suggesting that you need to seek in relationships someone who is not ‘dull’ but has similar interests, someone who you can talk to as well as enjoy the better parts of the physical relationship. You may already be doing this, but perhaps you should try harder to get to know the apparent ‘dull ones’. Sometimes it can take people time to open up. I am a prime example of this. If you asked the majority of people who know me about me, you probably wouldn’t find out that I interpret dreams for a hobby. You need to crack me open to find out who I really am. The nature of the introvert I guess.
Anyhow, I hope this helps. Let me know what you think.
Sweet dreams,
Rook
I see this dream as being linked to a point of transition in your life (symbolised by the crossroads). According to Jung our lives are made up of several different phases; childhood, adolescence, middle-age, and old-age. Given your age, I would say you are at the cusp moving from the adolescence / young adult stage of your life to the middle age stage.
Let’s look at these two stages: the adolescent / young adult stage is all about defining yourself within society. There is a lot of ego-development, you identify yourself largely by what you do, whether it is sport, your job, your musical genre etc. You basically build your life. Find a nice girl and settled down, maybe start a family. That is generally what society dictates we do – whether we do it or not is not always so.
In the middle-age stage it is theorised that people start to question what they built in the earlier stages, and question if this daily grind is all there is to life. Further, this can result in a mid-life crisis, which is more or less a freak-out and grasping for something more.
Now your dream begins with the aircraft crash. My theory on this is the aircraft is a symbol of the ego – the vehicle that elevates us, plus if you think specifically about Air Force pilots they are renowned for being of ‘the right stuff’ which values high self-confidence hence why they are renowned for arrogance. Perhaps not true these days but the stigma remains – in other words in my experience they are painted as ‘egotistical’. Hence the association I place on this symbol with the ego.
The fall of the ego can be associated with this particular phase as you come to realise that you don’t know everything – that nature often associated with youth; as well as the realisation that you are not indestructible. It can also be associated with the stripping away of many of the levels of personality that were developed in youth. You may be giving up some of the sports you playing in your youth, a lot of these things that helped establish and hold up our ego fall away. Now this can be a pretty frightening thing, when you strip all that away what is left? You have lost your identity and the life that you had, and had spent years building. You might feel empty. But it is a chance to come closer and explore your true self.
It is a bit like the sacrifice, you give up your life, and in that you find your self (not yourself) as it is the comprehension of your true self, who you really are deep inside. I think it is a Buddhist idea, I can’t remember exactly where I heard of that concept, but I understand it.
And this leads into the second part of this dream theory, as well as why I asked if you were familiar with the individuation process. I identify the woman in the dream as being a symbol of your anima – that is the feminine aspects of your psyche, that in men tends to be repressed. The fact that you know this woman suggested to me that you may have been consciously aware of this phenomenon or theory. That you aren’t familiar with it suggests that perhaps you are aware of your feminine side, and / or perhaps she represents something specific – which is the path I am leaning towards. The reason for this is your opinion of her and the role that she plays within the dream.
In your associations with her you state she is a looker, but very dull hence you don’t pay her much attention. I get the feeling this relates to your anima / feminine aspects, you may be aware they are their but do not explore them much as they are seen as dull or perhaps undesirable in substance, hence you do not know the substance of this inner being – you are aware of this woman but you have not really gotten to know her personality.
I think this is hinted in your interactions, you seem to be driven by sexual desire, while that is only a small part of what she is interested in. She is after a more balanced interaction – and seems more about communication (talking).
The scene that the interaction opens is the college – a place of learning and ‘higher education’. This establishes the theme of the dream. Splitting the roles, masculine / boys being conscious, the feminine / girls being the unconscious, this is shown in the layout of the college – the lower ground floor for girls would be the unconscious state, which you are barred from, or at least is not ‘meant for boys’, and the boys part would be the conscious part. However there is a staircase down to this level, you are able to access it, if you know where to look. This I see as the invitation to delve into the unconscious realm.
This is repeated in the next cut scene, the mansion is you, your life, and everything in it. Inside the mansion is the conscious state, outside (where the anima lives) is the unconscious. There is something under construction here, or about to be. It COULD be the new developments of the mid-life phase. Or a new beginning anyhow.
The tower I associate with the dreamscape – a bubble of consciousness within the unconscious realm. Now, why doesn’t the lift work? Because – there isn’t any fast easy way in here to open up this communication. It takes hard work, up the ladder. This I associate with the work of coming to understand and interpret dreams. Sometimes it takes a lot of work to get the meaning, but you know when you get it right because the insights will likely literally blow you away.
There are some interesting associations in the house to some of Jung’s theories, but I might look at that later. For the most part it seems to be about communication, talking, but you aren’t really focussing on that, you just want some action.
This points to the dogs, puppies (developing masculinity) bites your right (logical – masculine) hand. I think this is related to the sexual desire as well, the strong sexuality points to a masculine stance, for men it is a strong driver towards relationships. For women it is still important, but a much smaller part of the relationship than for men. I think this point is interfering with this development / communication.
Which I feel is a sub-morale / lower level interpretation of the dream, that being learning of the difference between men and women, and that for women the sexual act is still something they want (in fact a wise man pointed out to me once, women want it more than men, but they don’t need it like we do – it is a smaller driver for them).
To me it could be suggesting that you need to seek in relationships someone who is not ‘dull’ but has similar interests, someone who you can talk to as well as enjoy the better parts of the physical relationship. You may already be doing this, but perhaps you should try harder to get to know the apparent ‘dull ones’. Sometimes it can take people time to open up. I am a prime example of this. If you asked the majority of people who know me about me, you probably wouldn’t find out that I interpret dreams for a hobby. You need to crack me open to find out who I really am. The nature of the introvert I guess.
Anyhow, I hope this helps. Let me know what you think.
Sweet dreams,
Rook
Hey, thanks a lot for taking the time to reply!
I have a general idea of many of the theories of philosophy and psychology, but I haven't read it all in detail; I had read about Jung's anima-animus, only a paragraph or two, and I generally associated Jung only with the collective unconscious. I had always given more importance to Freud, and had read his book on the interpretation of dreams.
Something about myself: I am 30 years old, and I have an injury that pains off and on. I've always had an existentialist outlook, and over the years, I've gradually started losing interest in everything. For quite some time, my thoughts have turned "anti-sensuous", that the pleasures everyone runs after are fleeting and will come to an end, but there is something else that is without an end and timeless. But I haven't been able to give up the sensuous part completely, I keep getting drawn towards it. What I've been thinking of doing since the past few months is to ditch everything else and plunge fully into spirituality. And yes, I've often been told, or at least given hints, that I'm more girlish/childish than a man.
You have given a much deeper insight into my dream, but at the same time I've also become confused. I had prepared a pretty straightforward interpretation of my dream: the beginning of the dream is at a crossroads, which, like you said, signifies a moment of decision and change. I am at such a crossroads now. The fighter plane crashing signified my anxiety related to my plan of changing my life, that I am not fully ready yet. But why a Mirage, and not any other plane? I don't think much about this particular fighter; there are others that look much more awesome. The Mirage has a triangular shape:
http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/r ... 0-line.gif
So does this have to do with the 'will to pleasure' losing the battle to the 'will to meaning'? A long time back, I had a dream about a meteor about to crash, and I was afraid it would fall on top of me.
I never thought of the two separate floors as signifying the conscious and unconscious minds. I thought the inaccessibility to the girls' floor meant "I" was telling myself to give up all such pursuits. About the staircase, there is actually a staircase in our college that goes down from the first floor.
At the second crossroads, I had gone with the girl to her house; I thought that meant I had given in to pleasure, and the empty plot signified barrenness, a hint that while there may be pleasure in life, there's also pain. The tower could be a phallus symbol. It could also mean rising higher, but what did I do after climbing up - I was only interested in asking her to do it. I couldn't understand her reluctance, but you have interpreted it as this anima thing; I couldn't understand why her room was made of wooden planks either.
About the puppies, I first thought they signified innocence, and the second puppy did look fluffy. I was thinking about what word to use for the second puppy, and the word fluffy came to my mind; see the third definition here:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=fluffy
On the other hand, an angry dog signifies an inner conflict with the animal side of a person's nature. But why two puppies?
I am able to find some meaning for just about all the parts, but it is the end that stumps me, the part where she pisses on my thing. I've read that urine in dreams means cleansing oneself of things one thinks are wrong, but why does she have to piss on me? I still laugh whenever I remember this part. How do you explain it with the anima theory?
I'll have to read more about Jung, specially the anima-animus theory. Thanks again for your answer.
I have a general idea of many of the theories of philosophy and psychology, but I haven't read it all in detail; I had read about Jung's anima-animus, only a paragraph or two, and I generally associated Jung only with the collective unconscious. I had always given more importance to Freud, and had read his book on the interpretation of dreams.
Something about myself: I am 30 years old, and I have an injury that pains off and on. I've always had an existentialist outlook, and over the years, I've gradually started losing interest in everything. For quite some time, my thoughts have turned "anti-sensuous", that the pleasures everyone runs after are fleeting and will come to an end, but there is something else that is without an end and timeless. But I haven't been able to give up the sensuous part completely, I keep getting drawn towards it. What I've been thinking of doing since the past few months is to ditch everything else and plunge fully into spirituality. And yes, I've often been told, or at least given hints, that I'm more girlish/childish than a man.
You have given a much deeper insight into my dream, but at the same time I've also become confused. I had prepared a pretty straightforward interpretation of my dream: the beginning of the dream is at a crossroads, which, like you said, signifies a moment of decision and change. I am at such a crossroads now. The fighter plane crashing signified my anxiety related to my plan of changing my life, that I am not fully ready yet. But why a Mirage, and not any other plane? I don't think much about this particular fighter; there are others that look much more awesome. The Mirage has a triangular shape:
http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/r ... 0-line.gif
So does this have to do with the 'will to pleasure' losing the battle to the 'will to meaning'? A long time back, I had a dream about a meteor about to crash, and I was afraid it would fall on top of me.
I never thought of the two separate floors as signifying the conscious and unconscious minds. I thought the inaccessibility to the girls' floor meant "I" was telling myself to give up all such pursuits. About the staircase, there is actually a staircase in our college that goes down from the first floor.
At the second crossroads, I had gone with the girl to her house; I thought that meant I had given in to pleasure, and the empty plot signified barrenness, a hint that while there may be pleasure in life, there's also pain. The tower could be a phallus symbol. It could also mean rising higher, but what did I do after climbing up - I was only interested in asking her to do it. I couldn't understand her reluctance, but you have interpreted it as this anima thing; I couldn't understand why her room was made of wooden planks either.
About the puppies, I first thought they signified innocence, and the second puppy did look fluffy. I was thinking about what word to use for the second puppy, and the word fluffy came to my mind; see the third definition here:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=fluffy
On the other hand, an angry dog signifies an inner conflict with the animal side of a person's nature. But why two puppies?
I am able to find some meaning for just about all the parts, but it is the end that stumps me, the part where she pisses on my thing. I've read that urine in dreams means cleansing oneself of things one thinks are wrong, but why does she have to piss on me? I still laugh whenever I remember this part. How do you explain it with the anima theory?
I'll have to read more about Jung, specially the anima-animus theory. Thanks again for your answer.
Yes, it is said only the dreamer can truly interpret and understand the dream, others are but a guide. So I may make suggestions, but you will know better than I.
Jung vs Freud is interesting. I do need to study Freud’s work closer, but I find more affinity with Jungian analysis. With your interest seeming to lie closer to spirituality perhaps Jung might be worth a bit of a read. In my understanding (which is a little limited I’ll say right up front) Freud seems to be very scientific and almost atheist, while Jung has a stronger spiritual edge to it - Jung is far more than just the collective unconscious.
The aircraft is also quite a curious symbol to me. The Mirage having the delta wing, you could look at triangles, what leaps to mind to me is the elemental symbology of the Occult, which I would associate with air being an aircraft, of the mind. But I think that could be over analysis. Now the aircraft is VTOL, the only VTOL aircraft I am aware of is the Harrier, so logically the Harrier would be a better symbol if this were the key, but I think the key is in the name – mirage. Something that appears to be of a certain nature, but on closer inspection is something completely different.
My thoughts on this are two-fold. Firstly in relation to the girl; perhaps she is a mirage in the sense you have already dismissed her as dull which is keeping you from taking futher notice of her, perhaps she is a herself a mirage, and is different if you look closer. But then I don’t see how that relates to the imagery of the aircraft crashing on you. I see it more in relation again to the ego, but perhaps as the archetype of the persona – the mask we wear that unconsciously filters out what we don’t want outside to see. This is a mirage in a way.
Again, my intepretation relates to the fall of the ego, the persona crashing to be rebuilt as you transition into the next phase of life – again linked to the sandy patch outside of the mansion – it is a construction in the unconscious as new developments change your unconscious filter as to what society sees of your true self (but then that is just an idea).
There is still the question of why it is VTOL? Able to take off over a short distance – does this relate to your personality at all? Do you pick something up and go with it fairly easily?
Now onto the sexuality in the dream.
The tower being phallic – see this is where I diverge from Freud, I don’t see the significance of it. The dream is very sexual in nature with repeated sexual symbols, but I don’t get the feeling that it is intended to be sexually based, it’s not satisfying sexual urges, or sexual desires. You seem to want it to in the dream, heck after the dream is done you go back in for a better encounter. But throughout the dream, the theme seems to be based on a lack of interest in the act, lack of interest in the ladies part. So why a tower? I can’t see why, asides from that you have to climb the ladder, the easy way, the lift, it does not work.
I can see a link to spirituality here now that I think about it, though it may not apply to the dream, just out of interest. A semi-quote from Bill Moyers in discussion with Joseph Campbell about the spiritual path – something along the lines of “in this day of easy religion we can lose sight of the teachings in all religions that the trials are part of the journey.” I really relate to this because I tried to find my answers in scripture and books for so long but nothing really sunk in. It is only when I figure out concepts and ideas for myself that it really sinks in. That is climbing the ladder; taking the lift / getting the idea from a book doesn’t work for me – though that is an aside and probably not intended as part of the meaning for the dream.
So the tower I don’t know, I am just curious as to the significance of it as a phallic symbol.
As for the urination; I haven’t thought about that in depth.
The situation as I see it was that you were unsatisfied by the dream – you consciously wanted sexual gratification and didn’t get it, so you went back. The dream seems to have given you what you are pushing for, but picked up on that same theme earlier on, the sexual encounter not being as significant or important, which irritates you.
The urination itself what is that representive of? To me it speaks of disposing of that which the body does not need. In this case it maybe disposing of what your psyche doesn’t need? But hold on…
What about the need to ‘get it out of your system’? As a man I can understand that in relation to sexual desire and gratification. But the key here could be that this need might be unconsciously filtering your view of women, this particular ‘looker’ being a prime example of this ‘mirage-effect’.
I think you summed up what I am getting to here in your anti-sensuous thoughts / drive, and not being able to drive it out. This would be repressing it, and repression never works, it gets jammed into the unconscious, and comes out in other ways – especially with something as powerful as sexuality. It does not surprise me that this path did not work. You do need to ‘get it out of your system’. But at the same time this need does not constitute sensuality, that is pure sexuality. Sensuality involves a higher connection than just satisfying desires. It takes that communication to make the connection on a higher level.
It reminds me of Parsival who’s marriage to Condwiramurs takes place first on a spiritual level, and it is not until the fourth night that he realises (he is quite simple a man) that he should “entwine arms and legs”. I think this is a key repeated theme throughout the dream– that the pleasures of the flesh are not the important part of the interaction, but just an added bonus you might say.
And especially when you do have such a deep connection the passion (which is what seems to be the missing element in the woman in this dream) kicks in, wow. That’s all I can say, that is when the true experience I think you are seeking will be borne.
Now I think you raise an interesting point regarding the pleasures of life being fleeting, and that there is something more and timeless. I have been pondering similar lines of thought, but from a different view point. It almost sounds like basic Buddhism (I don’t really know advanced Buddhism). The first thing you are taught, perhaps the polar opposite, but that all life is sorrowful. And it is, but at the same time it passes and there are moments of great joy and happiness. The key is the world is dynamic – constantly shifting and changing. Some things that seem to be the same, aren’t. Like my home. It’s not in the same place it was, it’s actually moving about the same rate my fingernails grow towards Indonesia, and you know what? It’s gonna crash one day. Maybe in a couple of thousand years, but it will happen.
Life is, in my experience, a great drama; and it takes in the full spectrum of highs and lows. If we didn’t know the lows, the highs would become mundane. It’s meant to be this way and it is a great adventure, you just have to realise that. If the pleasures weren’t fleeting and it didn’t go away, I wouldn’t enjoy it so much when I did experience it.
Now you also speak of timelessness. It’s a great point to write to in my opinion as it is something I have also pondered with some external influences as well. Time, it is inherent in the world we live in, constantly shifting, and part of our direct experience. It is built into our every day in such great detail, we live by it, we work by it, it is essential to our day and what we have achieved. Without the concept of it we could not manage the society we live in. So I guess it’s not such a bad thing in my opinion anyhow.
But what is timelessness? Eternity? That is not all of time, it is outside of time. Time doesn’t exist in eternity. Heaven. Is it in death that this occurs? I don’t know, I hope not to find out for a while. But I feel that it is the concept of living in the moment. That here and now feeling that thinking in time cuts out. If you stop thinking and worrying about the future and the past, doing things for later, and enjoy the moment – that is what timelessness is. And such a different thing to grab hold of, and so slippery and easy a thing to let go of. Hmmm that’s Joseph Campbell – some other reading recommendation I would make – though I actually don’t read much Joseph Campbell – I much prefer to listen to it, there are some good audio on lectures of his he has given – and he is one of the greatest speakers I have listened to.
Looking now at the two dogs in the dream. I think that what you put down as the inner conflict with the animal side of a person’s nature is a pretty pertinent symbol right here. That seems to be the conflict that is taking place in the dream. But be careful – I only use a dream dictionary when I am really stuck. Reading the symbols is more about finding the associations you think fit with the dreams (I actually even got this concept through dream interpretation) and only if you are really struggling use the dictionary for guidance. The big question to me here, as you have stated, is why two dogs? I think it is a symbol of a duality, two extremes, the one dog who charges out and attacks, the other who sits back and watches. Relating it back to the dream I think it relates to the rest of the dream in the pursuit of women. There are those who aggressively chase, and the other is the one that sits back and watches till the woman they like walks out of their life without ever knowing (which is totally me in my youth). I think the place to be is somewhere in the middle (as with most dualities). Sitting back and finding that right personal connection, then taking action. That’s how I perceive the purpose of that symbol.
Now onto the topic of your will to pleasure vs will to meaning, and your contemplation of ditching everything and plunging fully into spirituality. All I can say on this is, as human beings we are such complicated beings. Consciously we are capable of being very focused on one particular thing, but my feelings always come back to the need for balance in all areas of our life. If we give something up to focus on something else, that is repression, and it will be moved into the realm of the unconscious, and it will come out in unintended ways. The need is to satisfy both the will to meaning AND the will to pleasure. Pleasure through meaning, meaning through pleasure. They are not one or the other, you can have both. It is healthier to have both in my opinion. But of course, as Obi-wan says, you have to do what you feel is right.
Jung vs Freud is interesting. I do need to study Freud’s work closer, but I find more affinity with Jungian analysis. With your interest seeming to lie closer to spirituality perhaps Jung might be worth a bit of a read. In my understanding (which is a little limited I’ll say right up front) Freud seems to be very scientific and almost atheist, while Jung has a stronger spiritual edge to it - Jung is far more than just the collective unconscious.
The aircraft is also quite a curious symbol to me. The Mirage having the delta wing, you could look at triangles, what leaps to mind to me is the elemental symbology of the Occult, which I would associate with air being an aircraft, of the mind. But I think that could be over analysis. Now the aircraft is VTOL, the only VTOL aircraft I am aware of is the Harrier, so logically the Harrier would be a better symbol if this were the key, but I think the key is in the name – mirage. Something that appears to be of a certain nature, but on closer inspection is something completely different.
My thoughts on this are two-fold. Firstly in relation to the girl; perhaps she is a mirage in the sense you have already dismissed her as dull which is keeping you from taking futher notice of her, perhaps she is a herself a mirage, and is different if you look closer. But then I don’t see how that relates to the imagery of the aircraft crashing on you. I see it more in relation again to the ego, but perhaps as the archetype of the persona – the mask we wear that unconsciously filters out what we don’t want outside to see. This is a mirage in a way.
Again, my intepretation relates to the fall of the ego, the persona crashing to be rebuilt as you transition into the next phase of life – again linked to the sandy patch outside of the mansion – it is a construction in the unconscious as new developments change your unconscious filter as to what society sees of your true self (but then that is just an idea).
There is still the question of why it is VTOL? Able to take off over a short distance – does this relate to your personality at all? Do you pick something up and go with it fairly easily?
Now onto the sexuality in the dream.
The tower being phallic – see this is where I diverge from Freud, I don’t see the significance of it. The dream is very sexual in nature with repeated sexual symbols, but I don’t get the feeling that it is intended to be sexually based, it’s not satisfying sexual urges, or sexual desires. You seem to want it to in the dream, heck after the dream is done you go back in for a better encounter. But throughout the dream, the theme seems to be based on a lack of interest in the act, lack of interest in the ladies part. So why a tower? I can’t see why, asides from that you have to climb the ladder, the easy way, the lift, it does not work.
I can see a link to spirituality here now that I think about it, though it may not apply to the dream, just out of interest. A semi-quote from Bill Moyers in discussion with Joseph Campbell about the spiritual path – something along the lines of “in this day of easy religion we can lose sight of the teachings in all religions that the trials are part of the journey.” I really relate to this because I tried to find my answers in scripture and books for so long but nothing really sunk in. It is only when I figure out concepts and ideas for myself that it really sinks in. That is climbing the ladder; taking the lift / getting the idea from a book doesn’t work for me – though that is an aside and probably not intended as part of the meaning for the dream.
So the tower I don’t know, I am just curious as to the significance of it as a phallic symbol.
As for the urination; I haven’t thought about that in depth.
The situation as I see it was that you were unsatisfied by the dream – you consciously wanted sexual gratification and didn’t get it, so you went back. The dream seems to have given you what you are pushing for, but picked up on that same theme earlier on, the sexual encounter not being as significant or important, which irritates you.
The urination itself what is that representive of? To me it speaks of disposing of that which the body does not need. In this case it maybe disposing of what your psyche doesn’t need? But hold on…
What about the need to ‘get it out of your system’? As a man I can understand that in relation to sexual desire and gratification. But the key here could be that this need might be unconsciously filtering your view of women, this particular ‘looker’ being a prime example of this ‘mirage-effect’.
I think you summed up what I am getting to here in your anti-sensuous thoughts / drive, and not being able to drive it out. This would be repressing it, and repression never works, it gets jammed into the unconscious, and comes out in other ways – especially with something as powerful as sexuality. It does not surprise me that this path did not work. You do need to ‘get it out of your system’. But at the same time this need does not constitute sensuality, that is pure sexuality. Sensuality involves a higher connection than just satisfying desires. It takes that communication to make the connection on a higher level.
It reminds me of Parsival who’s marriage to Condwiramurs takes place first on a spiritual level, and it is not until the fourth night that he realises (he is quite simple a man) that he should “entwine arms and legs”. I think this is a key repeated theme throughout the dream– that the pleasures of the flesh are not the important part of the interaction, but just an added bonus you might say.
And especially when you do have such a deep connection the passion (which is what seems to be the missing element in the woman in this dream) kicks in, wow. That’s all I can say, that is when the true experience I think you are seeking will be borne.
Now I think you raise an interesting point regarding the pleasures of life being fleeting, and that there is something more and timeless. I have been pondering similar lines of thought, but from a different view point. It almost sounds like basic Buddhism (I don’t really know advanced Buddhism). The first thing you are taught, perhaps the polar opposite, but that all life is sorrowful. And it is, but at the same time it passes and there are moments of great joy and happiness. The key is the world is dynamic – constantly shifting and changing. Some things that seem to be the same, aren’t. Like my home. It’s not in the same place it was, it’s actually moving about the same rate my fingernails grow towards Indonesia, and you know what? It’s gonna crash one day. Maybe in a couple of thousand years, but it will happen.
Life is, in my experience, a great drama; and it takes in the full spectrum of highs and lows. If we didn’t know the lows, the highs would become mundane. It’s meant to be this way and it is a great adventure, you just have to realise that. If the pleasures weren’t fleeting and it didn’t go away, I wouldn’t enjoy it so much when I did experience it.
Now you also speak of timelessness. It’s a great point to write to in my opinion as it is something I have also pondered with some external influences as well. Time, it is inherent in the world we live in, constantly shifting, and part of our direct experience. It is built into our every day in such great detail, we live by it, we work by it, it is essential to our day and what we have achieved. Without the concept of it we could not manage the society we live in. So I guess it’s not such a bad thing in my opinion anyhow.
But what is timelessness? Eternity? That is not all of time, it is outside of time. Time doesn’t exist in eternity. Heaven. Is it in death that this occurs? I don’t know, I hope not to find out for a while. But I feel that it is the concept of living in the moment. That here and now feeling that thinking in time cuts out. If you stop thinking and worrying about the future and the past, doing things for later, and enjoy the moment – that is what timelessness is. And such a different thing to grab hold of, and so slippery and easy a thing to let go of. Hmmm that’s Joseph Campbell – some other reading recommendation I would make – though I actually don’t read much Joseph Campbell – I much prefer to listen to it, there are some good audio on lectures of his he has given – and he is one of the greatest speakers I have listened to.
Looking now at the two dogs in the dream. I think that what you put down as the inner conflict with the animal side of a person’s nature is a pretty pertinent symbol right here. That seems to be the conflict that is taking place in the dream. But be careful – I only use a dream dictionary when I am really stuck. Reading the symbols is more about finding the associations you think fit with the dreams (I actually even got this concept through dream interpretation) and only if you are really struggling use the dictionary for guidance. The big question to me here, as you have stated, is why two dogs? I think it is a symbol of a duality, two extremes, the one dog who charges out and attacks, the other who sits back and watches. Relating it back to the dream I think it relates to the rest of the dream in the pursuit of women. There are those who aggressively chase, and the other is the one that sits back and watches till the woman they like walks out of their life without ever knowing (which is totally me in my youth). I think the place to be is somewhere in the middle (as with most dualities). Sitting back and finding that right personal connection, then taking action. That’s how I perceive the purpose of that symbol.
Now onto the topic of your will to pleasure vs will to meaning, and your contemplation of ditching everything and plunging fully into spirituality. All I can say on this is, as human beings we are such complicated beings. Consciously we are capable of being very focused on one particular thing, but my feelings always come back to the need for balance in all areas of our life. If we give something up to focus on something else, that is repression, and it will be moved into the realm of the unconscious, and it will come out in unintended ways. The need is to satisfy both the will to meaning AND the will to pleasure. Pleasure through meaning, meaning through pleasure. They are not one or the other, you can have both. It is healthier to have both in my opinion. But of course, as Obi-wan says, you have to do what you feel is right.
I missed that one; I think a pyramid with a separate top is the symbol of the Illuminati. I was interested in conspiracy theories some time back.Rook wrote: The aircraft is also quite a curious symbol to me. The Mirage having the delta wing, you could look at triangles, what leaps to mind to me is the elemental symbology of the Occult, which I would associate with air being an aircraft, of the mind.
There are quite a few others, like the F-35, and some variant of the Sukhoi. The one I like the most is the Sukhoi, but that wasn't the one in the dream.Rook wrote: But I think that could be over analysis. Now the aircraft is VTOL, the only VTOL aircraft I am aware of is the Harrier
Now I missed that completely! I see spiritual meanings everywhere, and the choice of the aircraft [a V-shaped one] could mean pleasures of this world which may be there for some time, or for quite a long time, but which are actually only a mirage and are bound to crash and bring pain in the end.Rook wrote: I think the key is in the name – mirage.
This is a point about dreams which I don't understand. From what I have read, dreams sometimes act as wish-fulfillment, so that if you want something and don't get it, you get it in the dream. The other purpose is to hint at something that is harming you (the latent content). Going by the little I've read about individuation, dreams also help you balance yourself by making you understand things.Rook wrote: Firstly in relation to the girl; perhaps she is a mirage in the sense you have already dismissed her as dull which is keeping you from taking further notice of her, perhaps she is a herself a mirage, and is different if you look closer.
What I'm trying to do at present is get rid of all things sensual - actually not all, I've never even thought of ditching music. So I want to get rid of thoughts regarding girls, and I have a dream in which a girl who looks great is not interested in me. But this would mean the dream is telling me that I am on the right path and is propelling me forwards by showing me how the material world can only offer dejection, but that is not how dreams work, do they? Dreams balance everything for you, and I don't see any balance here.
It didn't crash on me, it crashed to my side, I think the right side if I remember correctly. There was fear, but not panic, that it could crash on me. And yes, I had already seen the news on TV that the aircraft had crashed and the pilots were safe. This could be a balance, that my trying to ditch sensuality is bound to crash. But the pilots ejected. Damn, I feel like pulling my hair now...Rook wrote: But then I don’t see how that relates to the imagery of the aircraft crashing on you.
The sandy patch was surrounded on all sides by large buildings/houses. So if I do try and construct something there, I would still have to live with everyone else. Something like, I don't have to run off to the forest and live like a hermit, I can live in society and carry on with my activities.Rook wrote: Again, my intepretation relates to the fall of the ego, the persona crashing to be rebuilt as you transition into the next phase of life – again linked to the sandy patch outside of the mansion – it is a construction in the unconscious as new developments change your unconscious filter as to what society sees of your true self (but then that is just an idea).
I'm pretty lazy, so this part might have to do with not having to do the hard work of toiling on the runway but just taking off without any effort - something that is bound to fail. This could be seen as, I saw the news of the plane crash on TV, and then I was shown that the easier VTOL method was the cause of the crash. Then there's the lift not working part. But dreams don't give you meanings so naively, do they?Rook wrote: There is still the question of why it is VTOL? Able to take off over a short distance – does this relate to your personality at all?
I myself don't like Freud's finding sexual meanings everywhere. But sexuality isn't just about having sex, it is also about creation. The tower then represents a new enterprise.Rook wrote: The tower being phallic – see this is where I diverge from Freud, I don’t see the significance of it.
Rook wrote: As for the urination; I haven’t thought about that in depth.
The situation as I see it was that you were unsatisfied by the dream – you consciously wanted sexual gratification and didn’t get it, so you went back. The dream seems to have given you what you are pushing for, but picked up on that same theme earlier on, the sexual encounter not being as significant or important, which irritates you.
Can we label it as endorsing my world-view that the material doesn't have much to offer?
But I didn't piss, its the girl who did. And on top of me! :frustrated: I laugh and at the same time get mad when I think of that.Rook wrote: The urination itself what is that representive of? To me it speaks of disposing of that which the body does not need.
If there is something wrong in me, I am the one who'll get it out of my system. But it is the girl who does that. Can it be explained by the anima theory?
Another interpretation, the one I hit upon first when I thought of this, is that the dream waters down, or squashes, all hopes of getting sensual pleasure.
About why there are two dogs; I'm reminded of something. Read this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_of_Jiva_and_Atman
There's a theory of God as spectator, who watches all that goes on in this world. We as individuals suffer or rejoice, and when we let go of this world and aim higher, we gradually start rising until our consciousness merges with God's and we also become spectators.
In the dream, me and the second dog chomping on my thumb are one, with the dog representing the animal side. The first dog, the innocent one, is free of pain, and all actions, and is watching everything with aloofness.
Judging by the references you've made, you seem to have read a lot. I've read a bit myself, but every time I read someone's views on this world, I feel like I'm wasting my time, because those are just theories, and I keep thinking I should try and find out everything on my own.
You've mentioned Buddhist philosophy a couple of times; I am a Buddhist, but I haven't read much. Like I said in the previous para - and you mentioned this as well - reading the scriptures helps, but won't really get you anywhere.
Here is my opinion on this; people seem to love to try to classify things and define the meaning of things. And I see it done with dreams all the times. But my attitude is gnostic, belief through experience. And my experience is that dreams are so dynamic and profound, is it not possible they fill more than one or two functions, one or two possibilities? To me they are a great mystery, and I hope I never define exactly what dreams are and what they do, because that is when I will start trying to force my beliefs onto my dream interpretations, rather than approaching them with an open mind.MuDDlD wrote:This is a point about dreams which I don't understand. From what I have read, dreams sometimes act as wish-fulfillment, so that if you want something and don't get it, you get it in the dream. The other purpose is to hint at something that is harming you (the latent content). Going by the little I've read about individuation, dreams also help you balance yourself by making you understand things.
Now I can't say that I am not trying to force what I know thus far, but rather approach it with the attitude of asking: does this fit? If it doesn't, look at it another way. Perhaps it is not the anima - especially considering that as the anima is usually unconscious, it rarely takes the guise of someone that you actually know - hence my original question, I figured if you know of your anima can it take a conscious form? I think a wife / partner could fit the bill like a glove...
My point is that in approaching dreams it is best to pretend you know nothing about the dreamer, and try to get the symbols to paint the picture, rather than taking what you know, and making that fit the dream.
Yes, this could be a wish fulfillment dream - but I don't get that vibe, but then I think I have a different philosophy to yours, in that I see value in pleasure, regardless of whether it brings pain later, within reason. I wouldn't be like Golum putting the ring on as I plunge into the pit of lava, but then if I was like that would I even realise I was doing it? Perhaps not. It's your vibe that counts.
In relation to my concept of the girl being a mirage - that your predisposition to her being dull as the mirage - I get the feeling we can discard that path, it doesn't seem to strike a chord with you.
But then she was chosen in the dream for a reason? And why, as she plays a central role? Looking at your description - she is a looker, but dull. What do you think? I get the feeling she is a big key to the dream meaning.
Again - personally I don't like rules in dreams. I think there is a message here, not a balance. Balance in life is a key in my view, and dreams might facilitate that perhaps - but I think this dream is a big dream, and has a hidden puzzle message that you need to translate and understand. I also feel you will have similar dreams to this one that adds to the puzzle when you compare them, though they might not seem similar at first - that is a hunch, from experience.MuDDlD wrote:So I want to get rid of thoughts regarding girls, and I have a dream in which a girl who looks great is not interested in me. But this would mean the dream is telling me that I am on the right path and is propelling me forwards by showing me how the material world can only offer dejection, but that is not how dreams work, do they? Dreams balance everything for you, and I don't see any balance here.
This issue with girls, is it a common theme in your dreams? It is a prominent issue in your life right now, perhaps looking at other dreams regarding women might help to shine a light on an ongoing issue?
I don't think this location is spatial / geographical. It is a map of your psyche. You could go and live like a hermit, or live in society, I think you will still have your dreams of your house within a city, as well as your house in nature. I think it is symbolic, not geographical. That said I could see how your house within a city could fit with how you fit within your society, but again - that is symbolic. You might live out bush, but still be within society, hence dream of being within a city.MuDDlD wrote:The sandy patch was surrounded on all sides by large buildings/houses. So if I do try and construct something there, I would still have to live with everyone else. Something like, I don't have to run off to the forest and live like a hermit, I can live in society and carry on with my activities.
I LOVE how you have compared the VTOL aircraft to the lift. I think you are onto something there. Trying to do the easy thing not working - needing to do the hard work is important. Its a repeated symbol - a big key I believe. But how does that fit the issue with girls not being interested in you?
Pretending that the girl is representing your anima - you have to understand that the anima is you. So her urinating isn't someone else - it is you, but unconsciously, which is how repression works. You push it out of your conscious mind and it becomes the unconsciouses problem to deal with - hence your anima will relieve you of this. How will that come out? Perhaps dreams like these but involving sex? Or else it may come out in other ways - which probably won't be too pleasant.MuDDlD wrote:But I didn't piss, its the girl who did. And on top of me! :frustrated: I laugh and at the same time get mad when I think of that.
If there is something wrong in me, I am the one who'll get it out of my system. But it is the girl who does that. Can it be explained by the anima theory?
Hmmm, that basic rule of physics "energy can not be created or destroyed only changed in form" popped into my head, perhaps that works with energy of the psyche - and the sex energy can be quite powerful in men.
I have read bits and pieces and of a wide variety. I get the same feeling as you - I feel like I'm wasting my time, I want to find out everything on my own. I have read some Buddhism, and I respect that religion a lot, but I am not Buddhist, I have read more of the bible, and I respect a lot of the wisdom in there, but it doesn't fit with me.MuDDlD wrote:Judging by the references you've made, you seem to have read a lot. I've read a bit myself, but every time I read someone's views on this world, I feel like I'm wasting my time, because those are just theories, and I keep thinking I should try and find out everything on my own.
You've mentioned Buddhist philosophy a couple of times; I am a Buddhist, but I haven't read much. Like I said in the previous para - and you mentioned this as well - reading the scriptures helps, but won't really get you anywhere.
I guess I would say I followed Campbellism. Joseph Campbell - he spoke in the Power of Myth of a revelation he had in using his computer - the computer software is like Religion. For some people that software is great, it fits their profile so well, and they should use that software. For people like him, he is the programmer, he likes to fiddle with the software, taking bits and pieces of different ones, chopping and changing. And that is how he is, and it fits, though he states he will never have an experience comparable to that of a saint. All I can say is why not? I believe you could. That is a pretty good description of gnosticism too, which defines me quite well. I used to believe I was agnostic, until I found out you could get rid of that pesky 'a'.
Now I wouldn't say reading scripture is a waste of time really, I think it is important, but just because the Bible will state something, that I will grab it and jam it in my head. I read it, weigh it in my heart, and then either discard or absorb it. But being told something, it never seems to work as well as when I figure it out. Quite often some revelation will dawn on me, and then I will remember something I read / heard, and go "Ohhhhh, now I understand what that means" which is precisely how that exact point got hammered into me.
Now speaking on this point, I am seeing a pattern here, and I want to close with a list of quotes for you. I am getting the impression that wanting to just ditch "sensuality" might be a symptom of something else, something that might relate to this dream.
" a girl from my college came up and we had started talking. In real life, we hadn't talked much. This girl is a looker"
"All this time, I had thought that she was taking me to her house so that we could have sex,"
"She said something like it's not that she didn't want to have sex with me, but she didn't seem all that excited"
"One of her friends (whom I know, who is also a looker), was passing by"
"I was angry that such a beautiful dream had to end this way"
"'will to pleasure' losing the battle to the 'will to meaning'" (these two do not have to be in battle in my opinion - my best experience in pleasure is when it joins with meaning)
"I was only interested in asking her to do it. I couldn't understand her reluctance"
"get rid of all things sensual - actually not all, I've never even thought of ditching music. So I want to get rid of thoughts regarding girls"
"I have a dream in which a girl who looks great is not interested in me"
"squashes, all hopes of getting sensual pleasure"
I would like to leave it at that, I found that last quote really highlighted itself to me. Would be interested in hearing what you make of it, and if you can see any patterns in those quotes that may hit home.
Sorry, I just saw your post but I don't have the time to reply to it right now. I had logged in to post a similar dream of a few months back. I'll give a few replies though.
Here's the other dream; I think I had this one about six months ago.
I don't remember fully now, but in the beginning I was in some place where a scientific experiment was going on. It was a nuclear reactor, and when they began the experiment, I was very close to the actual reactor part. If I remember correctly, it was a place with a very high ceiling. Once the process started, I started feeling magnetism, especially in the back, and I was getting pulled towards the enclosed space where the reaction was going on. This girl was also present there, not exactly beside, but somewhere nearby. As the experiment proceeded, anything made of metal started getting bent and pulled towards the enclosed space. At this point, I decided that it was getting too dangerous, and that I should leave, so I pressed the release button, more like a 'flush' button, and was ejected by way of a tube containing liquid, like the one in the beginning of the first part of the film Matrix; the girl was also similarly ejected; I think it was I who ejected her. The place where the experiment was going on had got screwed up; I think the experiment had gone horribly wrong. We fell into a large open space, out of a hole in the ceiling along with a lot of water. The place we fell in was some kind of container holding water.
Now were in an apartment in a city, in the bathroom, and the apartment belonged to me. I'm not sure what floor we were on, but it was a high up, like the fifth or sixth floor. I fished out the girl from the tub we were in, and I bathed her in a shower, a decontamination measure, and I was sexually attracted towards her but I didn't do anything. She was really passive all through this; it was like she was weak. I rinsed her and wrapped her in a towel, and then put her in bed. I don't remember exactly, but there was mention about doing it, and I think she said tomorrow, or maybe we had done it, I just don't remember, and I think I didn't remember even when I woke up after the dream. In the next scene, it was morning (this whole episode had happened at night), and sunlight was filtering through the windows, but the windows were closed and there were wooden slits (wood again!) through which the light was coming in. I remember that there was more wood in the room. Again I don't remember but maybe we talked of doing it, or something else, but then all of a sudden things changed, and it turned out that this apartment of mine, which had been lying empty for quite some time, had been taken over by umm... "wrong" people who were running a whorehouse here. I walked to the back and saw that that there were other such apartments close by, and all these buildings were pretty close to each other and there were connecting channels running through them, I don't know what these are called, but its like Petronas Towers, where halfway up there's a channel connecting the two towers. This is similar to the connecting passages in my latest dream where the towers of different houses were connected by passages made by wooden planks. I had more than one apartment; the other two (?) were in other towers, and really close by, and this stuff was going on in the other ones as well, even in those not belonging to me. The girl at this time left in a car, and I suddenly came to know that my father (also my mother, if I remember correctly) was coming, and I was busy trying to clean the place up, and there were paper sheets lying here and there. The dream ended at about this point. I think there was more before and after, but I don't remember much.
What is wood symbolic of? If I remember correctly, a forest is a symbol of motherhood, of nurturing.
Edit: About the VTOL, one way an aircraft can take off is by taxiing on the runway, making a lot of noise, and involving speed, while the other one, the VTOL one, is a smoother one. I know VTOL also makes a lot of noise, but in movies, the runway scenes have thunderous sounds. Also, the first method involves running about/looking for something, while the VTOL one is about rising up calmly.
Now that you say this, I suddenly see some meaning here. My way of thinking is that we run after happiness, but even if we do get what we want, we don't always enjoy it as much as we want to. Now this girl could be mirage, of possible happiness, but even if I do get her, I doubt I'll enjoy it as much as I think or dream about, because I'll always be worried - and I keep worrying about just about everything - and in the end, it is only in salvation that all worries can come to an end.Rook wrote:In relation to my concept of the girl being a mirage - that your predisposition to her being dull as the mirage - I get the feeling we can discard that path, it doesn't seem to strike a chord with you.
During the last two or three months of college, I had developed a sudden interest in her; there were other girls, maybe even better lookers, but for some reason I was getting drawn towards her, and the reason is possibly that she seemed to be bored, not interested, in things around her. Now I myself want to be like that, I feel I should ditch what this world has to offer and not get perturbed by all its attractions. The girl herself was not interested in spirituality, as far as I know, she used to party and stuff. There's more about this I'll write later.Rook wrote:But then she was chosen in the dream for a reason? And why, as she plays a central role? Looking at your description - she is a looker, but dull. What do you think? I get the feeling she is a big key to the dream meaning.
Here's the other dream; I think I had this one about six months ago.
I don't remember fully now, but in the beginning I was in some place where a scientific experiment was going on. It was a nuclear reactor, and when they began the experiment, I was very close to the actual reactor part. If I remember correctly, it was a place with a very high ceiling. Once the process started, I started feeling magnetism, especially in the back, and I was getting pulled towards the enclosed space where the reaction was going on. This girl was also present there, not exactly beside, but somewhere nearby. As the experiment proceeded, anything made of metal started getting bent and pulled towards the enclosed space. At this point, I decided that it was getting too dangerous, and that I should leave, so I pressed the release button, more like a 'flush' button, and was ejected by way of a tube containing liquid, like the one in the beginning of the first part of the film Matrix; the girl was also similarly ejected; I think it was I who ejected her. The place where the experiment was going on had got screwed up; I think the experiment had gone horribly wrong. We fell into a large open space, out of a hole in the ceiling along with a lot of water. The place we fell in was some kind of container holding water.
Now were in an apartment in a city, in the bathroom, and the apartment belonged to me. I'm not sure what floor we were on, but it was a high up, like the fifth or sixth floor. I fished out the girl from the tub we were in, and I bathed her in a shower, a decontamination measure, and I was sexually attracted towards her but I didn't do anything. She was really passive all through this; it was like she was weak. I rinsed her and wrapped her in a towel, and then put her in bed. I don't remember exactly, but there was mention about doing it, and I think she said tomorrow, or maybe we had done it, I just don't remember, and I think I didn't remember even when I woke up after the dream. In the next scene, it was morning (this whole episode had happened at night), and sunlight was filtering through the windows, but the windows were closed and there were wooden slits (wood again!) through which the light was coming in. I remember that there was more wood in the room. Again I don't remember but maybe we talked of doing it, or something else, but then all of a sudden things changed, and it turned out that this apartment of mine, which had been lying empty for quite some time, had been taken over by umm... "wrong" people who were running a whorehouse here. I walked to the back and saw that that there were other such apartments close by, and all these buildings were pretty close to each other and there were connecting channels running through them, I don't know what these are called, but its like Petronas Towers, where halfway up there's a channel connecting the two towers. This is similar to the connecting passages in my latest dream where the towers of different houses were connected by passages made by wooden planks. I had more than one apartment; the other two (?) were in other towers, and really close by, and this stuff was going on in the other ones as well, even in those not belonging to me. The girl at this time left in a car, and I suddenly came to know that my father (also my mother, if I remember correctly) was coming, and I was busy trying to clean the place up, and there were paper sheets lying here and there. The dream ended at about this point. I think there was more before and after, but I don't remember much.
What is wood symbolic of? If I remember correctly, a forest is a symbol of motherhood, of nurturing.
Edit: About the VTOL, one way an aircraft can take off is by taxiing on the runway, making a lot of noise, and involving speed, while the other one, the VTOL one, is a smoother one. I know VTOL also makes a lot of noise, but in movies, the runway scenes have thunderous sounds. Also, the first method involves running about/looking for something, while the VTOL one is about rising up calmly.
Hi Muddld
This is an interesting dream; I will relate what I see. And that is; the nuclear reaction / experiment is the "magnetic" attraction / reaction between you two, I see it as being symbolic of the "awakening of love" between the two of you. And the experiment fails. Why? I don't know. It does seem you fail the experiment out of fear? It could be a fear of rejection. Or "cold feet" so to speak about moving into a relationship. Or perhaps there is something that you just feel is not right, which fits the description of the dream as you felt something had gone wrong with the "experiment" but you did not know what. The flushing I would say relates to repressing the situation, as water is a strong symbol of both the unconscious, as well as emotion, generally speaking, and that is where you end up, in the unconscious - the container holding water. That is - the emotions and failed attempt is put into unconscious storage.
The interesting part to me is the second part of the dream - I think this is relating what went wrong, why the "experiment" failed. To me reading it, the girl in the dream almost feels like a dummy / doll with nothing inside, just a pretty shell you might say. What this says to me is that the attraction is strongly based on physical attraction. This is reinforced to me by your statement that "I had developed a sudden interest in her; there were other girls, maybe even better lookers, but for some reason I was getting drawn towards her". You seem surprised that you were attracted to her when there were better lookers about. This implies a leaning towards physical attraction being a dominant initial draw card. Which is of course a completely natural way to be. But the awakening of love occurs on a deeper level. And you were leaning towards that with the position that she is bored / lacking interest in what is around her. But why does she feel that way? I think it is because she wants to be out partying, not stuck in college, where your interest in this view point is more spiritually oriented - though that is merely my observation. Turns out, your apartment is a 'whorehouse'. I think this is extreme symbolism designed to make a point. I'm not calling you a whore, but I think it is expressing that you have a strong sexual attraction as the basis of the relationship, rather than finding a personal / spiritual connection with a potential lover, which is why "experiments" or relationships are failing.
Now, on the point of wood, I have been wondering, why wood and what sets it apart? The thing that stands out to me is that wood is about the only "living" material used in construction, hence I infer that the wooden structures have been built from life experience, and is not part of your fixed character. This is reinforced to me by the links to other whorehouse apartments that you do not own. To me that says this is perhaps a construct built from the influence of others, and society, rather than from your own unique nature. That fits with me considering how sexualised our environment is these days, and the cultural experience I found growing up "with the boys" in my teens and young adult years, and the competition to who gets the pretty girls.
To me this dream seems to resonate with the symbol of the mirage - you might think it is the oasis in the desert, when it is actually just more sand. Actually now that I think about it, nuclear reactions don't work unless two of the right isotopes collide, if my extremely limited understanding of nuclear physics is right - the Nazi's failed because they thought bigger = better which was not the case, hence their nuclear tests didn't work because their material was too large. The experiment will only work when the two similar materials collide. I think that is what you need to find to get this reaction to take place. The substance, not the appearance. You need to find your soulmate - at a soul level, not on this empty physical plane.
Make sense?
Cheers,
Rook
This is an interesting dream; I will relate what I see. And that is; the nuclear reaction / experiment is the "magnetic" attraction / reaction between you two, I see it as being symbolic of the "awakening of love" between the two of you. And the experiment fails. Why? I don't know. It does seem you fail the experiment out of fear? It could be a fear of rejection. Or "cold feet" so to speak about moving into a relationship. Or perhaps there is something that you just feel is not right, which fits the description of the dream as you felt something had gone wrong with the "experiment" but you did not know what. The flushing I would say relates to repressing the situation, as water is a strong symbol of both the unconscious, as well as emotion, generally speaking, and that is where you end up, in the unconscious - the container holding water. That is - the emotions and failed attempt is put into unconscious storage.
The interesting part to me is the second part of the dream - I think this is relating what went wrong, why the "experiment" failed. To me reading it, the girl in the dream almost feels like a dummy / doll with nothing inside, just a pretty shell you might say. What this says to me is that the attraction is strongly based on physical attraction. This is reinforced to me by your statement that "I had developed a sudden interest in her; there were other girls, maybe even better lookers, but for some reason I was getting drawn towards her". You seem surprised that you were attracted to her when there were better lookers about. This implies a leaning towards physical attraction being a dominant initial draw card. Which is of course a completely natural way to be. But the awakening of love occurs on a deeper level. And you were leaning towards that with the position that she is bored / lacking interest in what is around her. But why does she feel that way? I think it is because she wants to be out partying, not stuck in college, where your interest in this view point is more spiritually oriented - though that is merely my observation. Turns out, your apartment is a 'whorehouse'. I think this is extreme symbolism designed to make a point. I'm not calling you a whore, but I think it is expressing that you have a strong sexual attraction as the basis of the relationship, rather than finding a personal / spiritual connection with a potential lover, which is why "experiments" or relationships are failing.
Now, on the point of wood, I have been wondering, why wood and what sets it apart? The thing that stands out to me is that wood is about the only "living" material used in construction, hence I infer that the wooden structures have been built from life experience, and is not part of your fixed character. This is reinforced to me by the links to other whorehouse apartments that you do not own. To me that says this is perhaps a construct built from the influence of others, and society, rather than from your own unique nature. That fits with me considering how sexualised our environment is these days, and the cultural experience I found growing up "with the boys" in my teens and young adult years, and the competition to who gets the pretty girls.
To me this dream seems to resonate with the symbol of the mirage - you might think it is the oasis in the desert, when it is actually just more sand. Actually now that I think about it, nuclear reactions don't work unless two of the right isotopes collide, if my extremely limited understanding of nuclear physics is right - the Nazi's failed because they thought bigger = better which was not the case, hence their nuclear tests didn't work because their material was too large. The experiment will only work when the two similar materials collide. I think that is what you need to find to get this reaction to take place. The substance, not the appearance. You need to find your soulmate - at a soul level, not on this empty physical plane.
Make sense?
Cheers,
Rook
There's another possible meaning: wood is dead: the tree was alive, but wood has no life. This could be hinting at the lifelessness of the relation, or the girl.Rook wrote: Now, on the point of wood, I have been wondering, why wood and what sets it apart? The thing that stands out to me is that wood is about the only "living" material used in construction, hence I infer that the wooden structures have been built from life experience, and is not part of your fixed character.
Also, wood is cut up and set into a shape, and polished. So a relation which is not natural is bound to fail. Here, natural could mean there should be love, and the whole thing shouldn't be about just sex, like you mentioned. Another way to look at this is that the relation should be natural in the sense that religion advocates sexual union only once, for bringing new life into this world, and not something to do be done many times, so a natural relation is about smoothness and not passionate sexual enjoyment.
I like the way you have interpreted the dreams. Earlier I used to label these as "sex" dreams, and the girl being dull was because the girl was actually dull, but I see that there's a lot more than this.
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