Is mystical knowledge a rite or a privilege?

[Fedora]

Hello all,

On February 1st I am launching an online and free (free copyright and free price) magazine to supplement my online community. It is in the works now and I can't wait to show it to you, but I need some help first.

I want to do a section called "Mystics of the World Wide Web" and question various communities on a topic pertinent to that particular issue, then I'll put the quotes together on a fun-to-read stylized page. If you would like the chance to be quoted, please respond to the following discussion question:

A tradition dating back to ancient mystery schools states that sacred and mystical knowledge can only be given if a person reveals their worth through a system of initiations and trials. Do you believe knowledge is a right or a privilege?

If you post in this thread I may use your quote in the online magazine (I will, of course, provide a link back here).

So? Whaddya think?

[spiritalk]

Consider....Mystery Schools:  They were places for learning the ins and outs of the mystical to apply to psychic input to the public mind.  The masters of the schools would want to keep knowledge mysterious so that they continue to control their own abilities.  Out of this jealousy and pride they offered only a scratch of the surface to students and insisted on initiations and rituals to make it even more mysterious as to those capable.  

When in all reality, anyone is capable of examining any information offered.  How they use it is another matter. Considering the mind has evolved through education on all levels, it would probably seem quite uneducated what was being offered.  

We are made up of body (the physical), mind (in both physical and spirit) and spirit (the inner finer vibration).  As we function we learn lessons and accumulate our wisdom.  This comes through both experience as well as book learning.  There is another source we seldom hear about:  the spirit attunement.

When we open to attunement with spirit through any of the worldwide techniques we find ourselves with information that would be  unavailable from our earth plane books and wisdom.

As all information is available to those who seek, how can it be other than a right to knowledge.

[sidewalk_bends]

Maybe it's neither a right nor a privilege. If something is a right, it would suggest that everyone can do as they wish with no limits. We may be afforded the ability to do something, but we may also be willed towards different paths. In other words, we may have free-will, but for how long? A privilege suggests there is something to gain. Perhaps there is nothing to gain, because in truth we own nothing, not the material, not the spiritual, nothing. We own nothing because everything belongs to everyone. We cannot take what is not ours to take. We cannot give what is not ours to give. Perhaps it just is. To say otherwise is to proclaim God's will?

[spiritalk]

Knowledge is free.  How we use it is according to personal responsibility.  It may seem there are no rules or guidance, but natural law works without favor to everyone.  This, then, would be the ultimate control on any information and how it is used.  God is wise and kind!  He can corral the errant, without judgement from others.

[lighting strikes twice]

I wonder how these mystery school masters would respond to these same two questions? I think they did and we can see their answer in the way they taught. In the beginning there was one school. As the school grew it was divided into two schools, the Lesser Mysteries and The Greater Mysteries. As a neophyte, you would enter the lesser mysteries. There you were taught and you were taught but you were unaware, that anything was being taught. The teachings were done in ways like a play, or in social gatherings. The purpose was to weed out the pure in heart from the not so pure. Reason? Give a child a loaded and cocked gun. As a Master, you learned how to manipulate the elements and had at your disposal powers that could take a life, or save a life , manipulate the weather and on goes the list of the unbelievable. In short-No Secrets-No Rights-No privilege just past the test, or don"t past the test. You get what your ready for but you can't rob and steal!

[Fedora]

Great responses! Keep'm coming!

[suzisco]

I don't think its a right or a priviledge, simply because every one has knowledge/ability/gifts. Its intrinsically bound up in who we are and in being human.  If you have had your ability inside you woken (through whatever means) then its yours to use, you can't take it away from that person and you can't stop them using it.  Even if they use their knowledge for "bad" purposes we still can't do anything about it.

I think to a certain extent mystical academys' stand to lose alot if the mystery shrouding their ceremonies/teaching methods etc was exposed as not necessary.
People would feel cheated.

There is one other thought, we as human love to be entertained and love the voyages into the "unknown" and the theatre of this kind of teaching would appeal to many people.  It gives them something of a thrill.  Everyone loves to be part of an exclusive club.  Exclusiveness means you are special.  Make these things ordinary and no one would be that interested.

[lighting strikes twice]

I SEE OUR JOURNEY AS A JIG SAW PUZZLE. BE WISE SEEKERS AND RESERVE YOUR JUDGEMENTS BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T, AND START ASSUMING THAT BECAUSE YOU CAN'T MAKE A PIECE FIT THROW IT AWAY-YOU WILL NEVER COMPLETE THE PUZZLE. BE TRUSTING AND OPEN. GOD BLESS

[sidewalk_bends]

I SEE OUR JOURNEY AS A JIG SAW PUZZLE. BE WISE SEEKERS AND RESERVE YOUR JUDGEMENTS BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T, AND START ASSUMING THAT BECAUSE YOU CAN'T MAKE A PIECE FIT THROW IT AWAY-YOU WILL NEVER COMPLETE THE PUZZLE. BE TRUSTING AND OPEN. GOD BLESS

Thanks!

[lighting strikes twice]

I SEE OUR JOURNEY AS A JIG SAW PUZZLE. BE WISE SEEKERS AND RESERVE YOUR JUDGEMENTS BECAUSE IF YOU DON'T, AND START ASSUMING THAT BECAUSE YOU CAN'T MAKE A PIECE FIT THROW IT AWAY-YOU WILL NEVER COMPLETE THE PUZZLE. BE TRUSTING AND OPEN. GOD BLESS

Thanks!

No - thank you. We are each part of that puzzle. We should never kick anyone out of our hearts. God Bless and good to meet you  :smt006

[Rohiniranjan]

[quote="Fedora"]Hello all,

On February 1st I am launching an online and free (free copyright and free price) magazine to supplement my online community. It is in the works now and I can't wait to show it to you, but I need some help first.

I want to do a section called "Mystics of the World Wide Web" and question various communities on a topic pertinent to that particular issue, then I'll put the quotes together on a fun-to-read stylized page. If you would like the chance to be quoted, please respond to the following discussion question:

[b]A tradition dating back to ancient mystery schools states that sacred and mystical knowledge can only be given if a person reveals their worth through a system of initiations and trials. Do you believe knowledge is a right or a privilege?[/b]

If you post in this thread I may use your quote in the online magazine (I will, of course, provide a link back here).

So? Whaddya think?[/quote]

Dear Fedora (love your TOPPING handle!),

What needs to be first clarified is this keyword: MYSTIC

What does it really mean in a modern, contemporary setting and context? Gone are the days when mystics tended to be relegated to cells and caves and mountaintops. As human society evolved, we find that fully-functioning MYSTICS can now exist amongst us. You may be sitting next to a perfectly venerable individual on the bus who seems engrossed in reading the book or newspaper and you may have no clue that this person could be an IT professional going to work but who is also an astrologer who passionately writes about astrology and gives readings and thus manages to maintain the work-life (physical-mental-spiritual) balance!

In the past it used to be so easy to separate the mystics from the Newtonian-Descartians! NOW, there are individuals who have embraced both realities: Newtonian-Descartian vs Boehmian-Heisenbergian, and manage to perform optimally in both!

Life has become more complex some would say, but isn't that what EVOLUTION is really all about? And I think evolution is really about the soul being allowed to enter and express more and more in the mundane, day to day reality!

Makes sense?

[lighting strikes twice]

I don't mean to hog but I found a comment very interesting and thought this article could shed more light on Descartian
To know who you really are, you have to detach yourself from the world and turn to your consciousness.

The world around us looks so real, and to proclaim that it is only an illusion may seem sheer nonsense. How can it be? Yet, it is possible to accept this idea. I believe you agree with me, if I say that the body is some sort of an extraordinary machine. It is made up of a combination of materials, but it functions as a unit. Can you say confidently that you are the body? Are you the hair that is cut and thrown away when you go to the hairdresser? The body changes through the years, are you this changing form?

Can you say that you are a particular thought? Many thoughts pass through the mind each day. They are like a movie that passes in front of your eyes. Sometimes the movie is interesting, and sometimes it is boring. Sometimes it engenders happy feelings sometimes it causes the rise of sadness or anger. Do you remember a thought that you thought an hour ago? Yesterday? How can these thoughts be the real you? You think of them, but you are not them.

The same thing goes for your feelings. It is not true to say, “I am angry”, “I am sad”, and “I am happy”. It is truer to say, “I am letting now a feeling of anger, sadness or happiness to occupy my consciousness for a while”. You, the basic you, stay the same, while feelings come and go. You are not your feelings, which change constantly.

THEN WHO ARE YOU? The mind cannot describe what is beyond it, because it has not been there. It can understand mental descriptions, which only give it a clue of the reality beyond it. To know who you really are, you have to transform your awareness beyond the mind. You are beyond the physical body, feelings and thoughts. You are the eternal, impersonal consciousness that created and infused life into this conglomeration of body, feelings and thoughts that you call “me”.

This homogeneous, indivisible, complete consciousness manifests in everything. It is the life principle of the manifestation that you consider to be yourself. The manifestation, which is the combination of body, thoughts and feelings, is nothing without this life principle. We can certainly say that the consciousness is the only real thing, and every manifestation is just a creation, and therefore not permanent, eternal or real in the sense that it can exist by itself.

Can you become aware of this great consciousness? Yes, of course. You are it. You are letting thoughts and feelings cloud it. If you constantly pay attention to the outside world, then it becomes very real for you. If you find a way to detach yourself from it, and turn your attention within, to the consciousness beyond the mind, you can tear off the screen of illusion, and live consciously in this great consciousness.

Silence of the mind is the prerequisite to awakening spiritually. Only when the mind is silenced and there are no thoughts, you realize who you really are — the vast, eternal consciousness.

This is what has been called spiritual awakening or enlightenment. This is what yogis, saints and seekers on the spiritual path seek. It is here and now. All you have to do is change the way you view the world. You have to learn to dis-identify yourself with your body, feelings and thoughts, and develop true detachment. Through constant meditation the mind is made quiet. Then, from deep inside will raise a great silence, peace, life, consciousness and being. This is the real you. This is enlightenment.

When you are spiritually awakened, your life will probably go on as before. You will still have to eat, sleep and take care of the physical life, though you know through your experience that everything is just an illusion. If you view a movie with detachment, you may enjoy it, yet you will not be moved by what happens in it. You know it is just a movie, the projection of light and color on a screen. You see it, but it does not cause thoughts or feelings to arise. It is the same with the world. The world is not real. You, your real “I”, live in an undifferentiated eternity, yet the body seems to continue to live in a created world.

When you are spiritually awakened nothing can influence you anymore. You are beyond life and death. You will still have to provide food, clothes and a house for the body, yet, whatever you do, you will do with inner detachment. You may go on acting intensively in the world, yet remaining uninvolved in consciousness, as if outside of the world.

When you wake up to your real consciousness, and manage to stay in it more or less permanently, you may disregard the power of the mind, or you may use it to mold your illusion — your world, though by now you stop believing in its reality.

Going beyond the mind, beyond the illusion of the world, and awakening spiritually, puts a great power and responsibility in your hands, for then you have the power to influence the world.

Tags:  enlightenment mind spirituality

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Posted in: Mind : 11.11.07

[Fedora]

Dear Fedora (love your TOPPING handle!),

What needs to be first clarified is this keyword: MYSTIC

What does it really mean in a modern, contemporary setting and context? Gone are the days when mystics tended to be relegated to cells and caves and mountaintops. As human society evolved, we find that fully-functioning MYSTICS can now exist amongst us. You may be sitting next to a perfectly venerable individual on the bus who seems engrossed in reading the book or newspaper and you may have no clue that this person could be an IT professional going to work but who is also an astrologer who passionately writes about astrology and gives readings and thus manages to maintain the work-life (physical-mental-spiritual) balance!

In the past it used to be so easy to separate the mystics from the Newtonian-Descartians! NOW, there are individuals who have embraced both realities: Newtonian-Descartian vs Boehmian-Heisenbergian, and manage to perform optimally in both!

Life has become more complex some would say, but isn't that what EVOLUTION is really all about? And I think evolution is really about the soul being allowed to enter and express more and more in the mundane, day to day reality!

Makes sense?

I've been resisting the urge to respond because I'm supposed to be objectively taking quotes for the publication, however, I have to heartedly agree with this post. The whole point behind this sort of discussion (and arguably the community I'm setting up) is to bring out the mystic in all of us in a practical, digestible and modern setting. Removing the exclusive and stuffy approach of Victorian era and the lofty and unobtainable approach of the classics I think we can get to the bare-bones of understanding our world simply by sharing with one another and learning with more than only the five senses.

Thanks again for all of your comments!

[lighting strikes twice]

(Fedora quote)
I've been resisting the urge to respond because I'm supposed to be objectively taking quotes for the publication, however, I have to heartedly agree with this post. The whole point behind this sort of discussion (and arguably the community I'm setting up) is to bring out the mystic in all of us in a practical, digestible and modern setting. Removing the exclusive and stuffy approach of Victorian era and the lofty and unobtainable approach of the classics I think we can get to the bare-bones of understanding our world simply by sharing with one another and learning with more than only the five senses.

Thanks again for all of your comments!


So you say.

[sidewalk_bends]

Dear Fedora (love your TOPPING handle!),

What needs to be first clarified is this keyword: MYSTIC

What does it really mean in a modern, contemporary setting and context? Gone are the days when mystics tended to be relegated to cells and caves and mountaintops. As human society evolved, we find that fully-functioning MYSTICS can now exist amongst us. You may be sitting next to a perfectly venerable individual on the bus who seems engrossed in reading the book or newspaper and you may have no clue that this person could be an IT professional going to work but who is also an astrologer who passionately writes about astrology and gives readings and thus manages to maintain the work-life (physical-mental-spiritual) balance!

In the past it used to be so easy to separate the mystics from the Newtonian-Descartians! NOW, there are individuals who have embraced both realities: Newtonian-Descartian vs Boehmian-Heisenbergian, and manage to perform optimally in both!

Life has become more complex some would say, but isn't that what EVOLUTION is really all about? And I think evolution is really about the soul being allowed to enter and express more and more in the mundane, day to day reality!

Makes sense?

I've been resisting the urge to respond because I'm supposed to be objectively taking quotes for the publication, however, I have to heartedly agree with this post. The whole point behind this sort of discussion (and arguably the community I'm setting up) is to bring out the mystic in all of us in a practical, digestible and modern setting. Removing the exclusive and stuffy approach of Victorian era and the lofty and unobtainable approach of the classics I think we can get to the bare-bones of understanding our world simply by sharing with one another and learning with more than only the five senses.

Thanks again for all of your comments!

That would make it an editorial.